What Makes British Audio Sound Like British Audio?

And I dont know why you cant see it, it may not say it in words but it is implied in the context of the post.
Ok so let me go through it for you, the guy posts, I have a funny feeling that these British loudspeakers may not be of the BBC LS3/5A school
:confused:
so the guy has just set a comparison between a bookshelf nearfield monitor that is designed to work in the back of a van and a large stand mounted/ floorstanding speaker, it is obvious that the 2 speakers are aimed at different markets and potential customers, there is no need to bring the 2 speakers together in that post, the way the post is implied is that somehow the TDB-12 is going to be inferior in performance to the LS3/5A which is like saying a Harbeth 40.2 is also inferior to the LS3/5A (ive used the Harbeth as it is of similar size and driver compliment to the TDB-12). I do actually make an LS3/5A type speaker, its called the BC-30, that side and back to the point, why select the TDB-12 to be in the BBC LS3/5A school, is there something you dont like about them? do you think they are not worthy? is it the look of them? maybe you dont like the level pads on there? just exactly what is it that gives you that funny feeling? when you look at a 40.2 do you get the same funny feeling, or maybe looking at a vintage Wharfedale E70 does that also give you the funny feeling? how about a big pair of Tannoy HPD's with a 15" driver and a horn loaded tweeter to compare with the LS3/5A will that give you the funny feeling too? or maybe a pair of LEAK 3090s, surely a nice pair of Wharfedale Dovedales with a 12" bass a 5" mid and a 1" mylar dome tweeter (ive selected those few models because they were all designed around the same period as the LS3/5A) and all sound completely different to them but yet still retain the British sound, so tell me what does give you that funny feeling and the need to make the comparison..?

Wow.
Ok. So YOU are saying that because your speakers aren't based on the BBC monitor design, then they are inferior? It must the case, because no one else here has said it. No one else has implied it.
I was the one who started that thread, and I took a little license in what I said, because it was obviously based on a false premise. That being, that there is a conclusive British sound to audio. Anyone with any knowledge of audio with know that it is not the case. If we look at speakers, for example, while there are BBC monitor types, there are also Quads, Tannoys, etc. Which are all, obviously, vastly different.
When I stated British Audio, I was referring to what some would call Flat Earth audio. So smaller, mid range focused, speakers that often lean towards vocals and speed. Stuff that had been based on BBC designs, and made by companies like Spendor, Harbeths, Stirling, etc. These are often matched with Naim, Rega or Exposure amps, and often fed from Linn or Rega sources. This is a school of audio that had become very popular, is often called British (or English) Audio, that I, and many of my friends enjoy, hence my decision to start this discussion.

What Mr Hardy did, in his often joking manner, is to point out my false premise by showing a British speaker that was very different from what I had been discussing. Not that it was worse, or better for that matter. Just that it could be considered part of British Audio, AND it was not what we were discussing. Your speaker was just a very clear reminder that not every British speaker is what we were discussing.

Let's look at this from a different perspective. What if my question was "What makes British Cars Drive Like British Cars". So the discussion turns to big, Luxurious, fast GTs, full of burled walnut and Connolly Leather. Aston Martin, Jaguar, Bentley, etc. The conversation goes merrily along, and then Mr Hardy, because he would do so, posts a picture of a Lotus Elise. Should I expect the ghost of Colin Chapman to haunt the site? Of course not. Because there was nothing negative in the comparison. It just so happens that a Lotus is also a British car, which happens to be very different.

The only inference I could make that your speakers are not worthy of inclusion in this group, is, strangely, from you. Based on the picture, I would guess that yours is a studio monitor, looking somewhat similar to a JBL perhaps. And that's all I would have thought of it. That's all I did think if it.

I can't imagine what would have happened if someone had posted that they heard them , and did not like them.

There is one thing this discussion has made very clear to me, however. That is, that I will never purchase a Kralk Audio product.

All the best to you.
 
And I dont know why you cant see it, it may not say it in words but it is implied in the context of the post.
Ok so let me go through it for you, the guy posts, I have a funny feeling that these British loudspeakers may not be of the BBC LS3/5A school
:confused:
so the guy has just set a comparison between a bookshelf nearfield monitor that is designed to work in the back of a van and a large stand mounted/ floorstanding speaker, it is obvious that the 2 speakers are aimed at different markets and potential customers, there is no need to bring the 2 speakers together in that post, the way the post is implied is that somehow the TDB-12 is going to be inferior in performance to the LS3/5A which is like saying a Harbeth 40.2 is also inferior to the LS3/5A (ive used the Harbeth as it is of similar size and driver compliment to the TDB-12). I do actually make an LS3/5A type speaker, its called the BC-30, that side and back to the point, why select the TDB-12 to be in the BBC LS3/5A school, is there something you dont like about them? do you think they are not worthy? is it the look of them? maybe you dont like the level pads on there? just exactly what is it that gives you that funny feeling? when you look at a 40.2 do you get the same funny feeling, or maybe looking at a vintage Wharfedale E70 does that also give you the funny feeling? how about a big pair of Tannoy HPD's with a 15" driver and a horn loaded tweeter to compare with the LS3/5A will that give you the funny feeling too? or maybe a pair of LEAK 3090s, surely a nice pair of Wharfedale Dovedales with a 12" bass a 5" mid and a 1" mylar dome tweeter (ive selected those few models because they were all designed around the same period as the LS3/5A) and all sound completely different to them but yet still retain the British sound, so tell me what does give you that funny feeling and the need to make the comparison..? heres a picture of the back of that bass driver in case you think may be it has a small motor unit on it..View attachment 8663
I don't see where anyone made even the vaguest reference to "inferior performance". A different flavour and purpose, certainly. I'm sure many here would love to hear your speakers - not to compare them to LS3/5A types, but in their own right. "Worthiness" has not a thing to do with any of the comments as far as I can see.
 
You see this is what happens when you do stupid stuff like this on forums, poking a little fun for your amusement at something you have never heard and assuming by the look of something that you are in someway correct, the thing I objected to was talking about the 2 speakers in the same context when you knew nothing about them, and why choose my speaker as an example when there are so many others, to be fair I really am disappointed in the forum as its certainly not making HiFi fun, I don't mind people hearing the speakers and disliking them its their choice, poking fun at something that they have never heard is a different matter altogether, I still don't understand why my speaker was used dispute your quite lengthy reply, I've made my point quit clear, it seems you are having difficulty seeing why I might be questioning why my speaker was used in the context it was and I'm just a little disappointed nobody can come up with a decent explanation, a nice OK sorry it was used in the wrong context would have been nice..
 
You see this is what happens when you do stupid stuff like this on forums, poking a little fun for your amusement at something you have never heard and assuming by the look of something that you are in someway correct, the thing I objected to was talking about the 2 speakers in the same context when you knew nothing about them, and why choose my speaker as an example when there are so many others, to be fair I really am disappointed in the forum as its certainly not making HiFi fun, I don't mind people hearing the speakers and disliking them its their choice, poking fun at something that they have never heard is a different matter altogether, I still don't understand why my speaker was used dispute your quite lengthy reply, I've made my point quit clear, it seems you are having difficulty seeing why I might be questioning why my speaker was used in the context it was and I'm just a little disappointed nobody can come up with a decent explanation, a nice OK sorry it was used in the wrong context would have been nice..
If you are not advertising your speaker in the same class he mentioned them in then where’s the harm? There’s a difference between coming to the defense of your product and just being defensive. Either offer clarification on another persons misconception and have an opportunity to tout your product.....or be standing in a hole with you holding the shovel.
 
You see this is what happens when you do stupid stuff like this on forums, poking a little fun for your amusement at something you have never heard and assuming by the look of something that you are in someway correct, the thing I objected to was talking about the 2 speakers in the same context when you knew nothing about them, and why choose my speaker as an example when there are so many others, to be fair I really am disappointed in the forum as its certainly not making HiFi fun, I don't mind people hearing the speakers and disliking them its their choice, poking fun at something that they have never heard is a different matter altogether, I still don't understand why my speaker was used dispute your quite lengthy reply, I've made my point quit clear, it seems you are having difficulty seeing why I might be questioning why my speaker was used in the context it was and I'm just a little disappointed nobody can come up with a decent explanation, a nice OK sorry it was used in the wrong context would have been nice..
I don't think anyone was actually poking fun - honestly. As pointed out, it was an attempt to show that Brit audio has a range and is not the monolithic single direction entity many would have it. Your speaker happened to be chosen as an example which does not fit the fabled stereotype.... emphasis on "fabled".

Rather than leaping in and finding offense with what was said perhaps hanging around here for a bit and getting a feel for how this relatively small audio community discusses things would undoubtedly have made any statements vastly clearer. We are a pretty laid-back lot, very informal in our communication and very often tongue-in-cheek in terms of humour. We are an open-minded bunch, both in audio and in other areas. Hang out, get a feel for who we are and then rethink a bit perhaps?
 
For the record I became interested in your speakers and frankly only found out about them thanks to @mhardy6647 . It’s safe to say that he meant no harm and brought good publicity to your speakers.
 
You see this is what happens when you do stupid stuff like this on forums, poking a little fun for your amusement at something you have never heard and assuming by the look of something that you are in someway correct, the thing I objected to was talking about the 2 speakers in the same context when you knew nothing about them, and why choose my speaker as an example when there are so many others, to be fair I really am disappointed in the forum as its certainly not making HiFi fun, I don't mind people hearing the speakers and disliking them its their choice, poking fun at something that they have never heard is a different matter altogether, I still don't understand why my speaker was used dispute your quite lengthy reply, I've made my point quit clear, it seems you are having difficulty seeing why I might be questioning why my speaker was used in the context it was and I'm just a little disappointed nobody can come up with a decent explanation, a nice OK sorry it was used in the wrong context would have been nice..

You, sir, need to quit taking everything so seriously.

Try relaxing and having a little fun with our wonderful hobby.

Just my opinion. :)
 
And
You see this is what happens when you do stupid stuff like this on forums, poking a little fun for your amusement at something you have never heard and assuming by the look of something that you are in someway correct, the thing I objected to was talking about the 2 speakers in the same context when you knew nothing about them, and why choose my speaker as an example when there are so many others, to be fair I really am disappointed in the forum as its certainly not making HiFi fun, I don't mind people hearing the speakers and disliking them its their choice, poking fun at something that they have never heard is a different matter altogether, I still don't understand why my speaker was used dispute your quite lengthy reply, I've made my point quit clear, it seems you are having difficulty seeing why I might be questioning why my speaker was used in the context it was and I'm just a little disappointed nobody can come up with a decent explanation, a nice OK sorry it was used in the wrong context would have been nice..

Ok. The long answer didn't work. So I'll try a different approach.

NO. ONE. MADE. FUN. OF. YOUR. SPEAKERS.

NO. ONE. SAID. THEY. WERE. INFERIOR.

Have a nice day.
 
I’m not sure what “British audio” sounds like anymore. I thought I did. I owned a pair of B&W DM5 and loved em. KEF Q80’s, lived with them for over 20 years. Sold both KEF and B&W in a HiFi shop/shoppe and loved both lines back in the late 70’s/early 80’s. Don’t much care for either line now but do own a pair of Spendor A6 I’m crazy about and have been listening to for @5 years now.

On the amplifier side, owned a Rega Brio and ugh. Musical Fidelity M6i, a monster amp that sounded really good, Naim 5si was excellent but found my way into tubes with my current Primaluna Dialogue Integrated.

Rega RP3 was just frustrating, a Thorens TD165 sounds great but is still frustrating. Vintage Microseiki is VERY nice with a Jelco arm.

What drew me into the British sound initially was a the vocal tonality, timbral accuracy (to me), and quick mid-bass. Nothing 20Hz to 20kHz ruler flat response has ever overly impressed and I don’t think that is what British audio is about.

It’s that PRaT thing.
 
And


Ok. The long answer didn't work. So I'll try a different approach.

NO. ONE. MADE. FUN. OF. YOUR. SPEAKERS.

NO. ONE. SAID. THEY. WERE. INFERIOR.

Have a nice day.
Seems like non of my requests for an answer got through and you decided caps lock might convince me to see something different, all I asked is why the poster felt the need to use my speaker as an example of why they were not of the BBC ls3/5a school, what was the funny feeling he had..? I'm not trying to pick a fight here I just think its a perfectly normal thing to ask given that it is my product and I was simply asking why he felt the need to use my speaker as an example, I managed all that without resorting to caps locks to get the point across, if he's poking a little fun I don't mind to be fair its forum banter so the simple question is why my speaker..?
 
Seems like non of my requests for an answer got through and you decided caps lock might convince me to see something different, all I asked is why the poster felt the need to use my speaker as an example of why they were not of the BBC ls3/5a school, what was the funny feeling he had..? I'm not trying to pick a fight here I just think its a perfectly normal thing to ask given that it is my product and I was simply asking why he felt the need to use my speaker as an example, I managed all that without resorting to caps locks to get the point across, if he's poking a little fun I don't mind to be fair its forum banter so the simple question is why my speaker..?

Just because it looked dramatically different from this:

715falcon.promo_.jpg
 
Just because it looked dramatically different from this:

View attachment 8664

To the folks at Falcon Accoustics:

Please understand that I in no way mean to disparage your speakers by choosing them as an example of what a BBC monitor looks like. I only choose yours, because it was the first example that came up when I googled for an image of one. I understand that your speakers are amongst the finest ever based on the LS3/5a.
 
Just because it looked dramatically different from this:

View attachment 8664
That's great, now we are getting somewhere, so out of all the British loudspeaker companies that exist, why pick a small one man companies speaker to make the example with?, the reason I'm quite miffed about him doing so is because even through you all might not see any harm in it, depending on where you are in the world and how you interpret things I can come across quite differently, somebody reading that may read it as the speakers don't have a typically British sound and if they were thinking about purchasing some might not bother, even though the poster has never even heard them, he is just going by looks alone, if you want to have a bit of a laugh about them its fine I don't mind, they do look a bit like 80s jamos and it was completely intentional in the design, it seems that is what is coming back in fashion, I designed these before jbl announced the return of the L100, its horses for courses, you either love them or hate them, in England when somebody says they have a funny feeling about something it means that something is not quite right about something, they are unsure of what it is, take that from an English point of view and the poster is saying, he is unsure about these speakers and he doesn't think they will have the BBC sound, I'm not going any further with this as there is obviously a language barrier, but I've tried to show it from a different point of view..
 
That's great, now we are getting somewhere, so out of all the British loudspeaker companies that exist, why pick a small one man companies speaker to make the example with?, the reason I'm quite miffed about him doing so is because even through you all might not see any harm in it, depending on where you are in the world and how you interpret things I can come across quite differently, somebody reading that may read it as the speakers don't have a typically British sound and if they were thinking about purchasing some might not bother, even though the poster has never even heard them, he is just going by looks alone, if you want to have a bit of a laugh about them its fine I don't mind, they do look a bit like 80s jamos and it was completely intentional in the design, it seems that is what is coming back in fashion, I designed these before jbl announced the return of the L100, its horses for courses, you either love them or hate them, in England when somebody says they have a funny feeling about something it means that something is not quite right about something, they are unsure of what it is, take that from an English point of view and the poster is saying, he is unsure about these speakers and he doesn't think they will have the BBC sound, I'm not going any further with this as there is obviously a language barrier, but I've tried to show it from a different point of view..

Ahem.....

I happen to be born and raised in the USA but a sizable number of Havenites, including the founder and owner (@Prime Minister ), are Canadian. :)

Thought all y'all belonged to the same Commonwealth. ;) ;)
 
That's great, now we are getting somewhere, so out of all the British loudspeaker companies that exist, why pick a small one man companies speaker to make the example with?, the reason I'm quite miffed about him doing so is because even through you all might not see any harm in it, depending on where you are in the world and how you interpret things I can come across quite differently, somebody reading that may read it as the speakers don't have a typically British sound and if they were thinking about purchasing some might not bother, even though the poster has never even heard them, he is just going by looks alone, if you want to have a bit of a laugh about them its fine I don't mind, they do look a bit like 80s jamos and it was completely intentional in the design, it seems that is what is coming back in fashion, I designed these before jbl announced the return of the L100, its horses for courses, you either love them or hate them, in England when somebody says they have a funny feeling about something it means that something is not quite right about something, they are unsure of what it is, take that from an English point of view and the poster is saying, he is unsure about these speakers and he doesn't think they will have the BBC sound, I'm not going any further with this as there is obviously a language barrier, but I've tried to show it from a different point of view..

I don't see a language barrier here. As another loyal subject of Elizabeth the Second, by the Grace of God, Queen of Canada and of Her other realms and territories, Head of the Commonwealth, Defender of the Faith, I think I was comprehending the language pretty well. However, what I didn't get, is your motivation for making an issue of it.

Now, if I were running your business, and I saw a picture of my product come up in a thread, I'd have said something like:

"Thanks very much for showing my product in your thread on British Audio. While I understand that my Speakers don't look stereotypicalily like one might expect a British speaker to look like, sound wise, my design decisions are still very much made around a love of that wonderful BBC monitor sound.

I'd be thrilled for you to have a listen to what we have made. In particular, if you are a fan of the BBC monitor sound, you might love our new Superspeaker 2000, with woofers weaved from fresh Scottish Heather.

Please let me know if you have any more questions, or if I can help arrange an audition."

Now, if you would have posted something like that, we would have been having a jolly great discussion on the merits of Kralk Speakers. You would have made new friends and fans. A few hundred folks would know about your speakers now, and who knows, you might have made a sale or two.

Instead, you chose to attack a poster you didn't know, and argue about an insult to your product that never happened. At least not here. This is a small and friendly group, that will often poke fun at each other. Which is precisely what happened here. But again, no one has said anything bad about your product.

The Haven, more so then many sites, is very friendly to small manufacturers. If you had come in like a friend, to share and educate, we'd let you post as much about your product as you like. We don't even charge manufacturers for advertising. But rather you chose to come in with both fists swinging, and then you wonder why we aren't getting along.
 
I didn't swing fists or use caps locks, I asked a simple question, the first of which was , what makes you say that, you took it from there, I've not said a nasty word to any of you, you however start ranting on about never buying my products etc etc, I tried to show you how it could be taken from a different prospective but you ignore that and try to turn the situation around to make me look bad, I will ask again, what was the funny feeling he had when he felt the need to use a picture of the TDB-12? You afforded Jerry an apology disclaimer for using his falcons as an example but it seems the query I have just gets ignored as me being argumentative and trying to pick a fight, when all I'm simply asking is why did he decided my speaker was an example of something that he felt didn't fit the BBC sound, its as simple as that, all the answer needed to be was something like, well I didn't think looking at them they would do, to be fair he did ask for enlightenment which I gave, I just never had an answer to my original question..
 
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