A deep-dive into digital streaming

[rogerfederer]

the idea of stereo bluetooth speakers is intriguing, esp as i have a jbl extreme2
however, from this it looks like this feature works w the extreme3 but not the 2:

How do I pair JBL speakers with Connect+ or PartyBoost?

More speakers mean more party! Learn how to pair JBL speakers with JBL Connect+ or PartyBoost More volume or stereo sound, anything is possible.

uk.jbl.com

have i got that right?

 

[billfort]

Yes, I think it's kind of touchy about mixing speakers. I had read that the Flip 6 stereo thing only works with another Flip 6, even a very similar Flip 5 isn't supported. It even seems to force the app's adjustable EQ deal off.

There's a chance 'party' mode might be more flexible as it allows using several speakers to play together, but all in mono. That mode is ok but the 'stereo' setting sounds a lot better. There is certainly channel specific sounds happening and a decent dose of that nice big bloom you get sometimes with well done stereo (like on that Junkies album).

I don't know that this is real stereo, I mean it's a couple Bluetooth outdoor 'party' speakers sitting on a table with an app somehow getting you to stereo, but damned if it doesn't sound bloody good sitting out here in the sun.

 

[billfort]

A hiccup with Qobuz playing straight up from my old phone wirelessly to the JBLs - some drop outs while out on the patio.

Ok, it's outside with the home WiFi, and only seems to happen with hi-res content, which is pretty pointless anyway with Bluetooth connected speakers. A drop in the Qobuz app to CD quality 16/44.1 and problem solved.

For some reason, the CD quality Qobuz stream sounds better than the mp3 off Spotify too, which kind of surprises me with these lowly Bluetooth JBLs, but whatever, nice to have the option.

Loving Qobuz.

 

[marantzfan]

I think I’m about ready to make some changes. I have a Tidal family plan and a Roon subscription.

Neither of these are cheap. I don’t have a ton of DSD files, truth be told I spend a lot more time listening to Tidal.

I’m interested in switching to Qobuz. It looks like the family plan is significantly less than Tidal. My only concern is the “under one roof” clause since, for example, I have my dad on my plan and he doesn’t obviously live with me.

I’m also tired of paying $150/year for Roon.

Interested in possibly going the route that you went here Bill. Is this system easy to use on multiple endpoints and with both PC and RPi?

 

[jmathers]

I switched to Qobuz late last year and then this summer quit Roon and switched to LMS with PiCorePlayer for my endpoints. All working well and was surprised the amount of info available via the Material Skin with PcP - lyrics, biographies, album liner notes, etc. Not Roon but close. I have plenty o'DSD files that play flawlessly too. And saving a couple hundred bucks a year as well. If you need more info let me know.

 

[MikeyFresh]

I switched to Qobuz late last year and then this summer quit Roon and switched to LMS with PiCorePlayer for my endpoints. All working well and was surprised the amount of info available via the Material Skin with PcP - lyrics, biographies, album liner notes, etc. Not Roon but close. I have plenty o'DSD files that play flawlessly too. And saving a couple hundred bucks a year as well. If you need more info let me know.

I'm not surprised you are more than surviving without Roon, and certainly one of the massive value propositions offered by the fabulous Raspberry Pi platform is not just the inexpensive aspect of the hardware itself, but the flexibility available in switching the software in use simply by swapping in a different microSD card.

Yes there is setup work involved as with any software, but something like pCP offers an enormous payoff in the end once the initial set and forget configuration is all done. You can then try that out all the while keeping any original software (i.e. RoPieee, Volumio, Moode, etc...) off to the side in case you want to use it again, and much of it is interoperable anyway, you can make a previously DLNA/UPnP endpoint such as Moode a Squeezelite renderer with just 3 clicks.

A distro like pCP is also super convenient in that it can be both a server and an endpoint/player simultaneously, and it doesn't struggle with doing that double duty despite the somewhat limited system resources in terms of the CPU and RAM of the Raspberry Pi.

I've never been a Roon user, however I am ready to demote my daily driver DLNA/UPnP server to backup status, and use LMS moving forward. I have already setup and used both a separate LMS running on Ubuntu, and also a combined LMS/Squeezelite renderer running on pCP as both you, and more recently @OldNick have done. A very ready for primetime solution to say the least, though at last check-in the pCP gods were frowning on @MrEd for some reason, but perhaps by now he's made amends with them and had his streaming rights reinstated. Or maybe the pCP gods weren't involved and his system just auto-updated at an inopportune moment as has happened to others in the past with RoPieee for example. I always disable auto updates for that very reason, I hate surprises, I want updates done in an orderly fashion and at my own choosing.

 

[MrEd]

I'm not surprised you are more than surviving without Roon, and certainly one of the massive value propositions offered by the fabulous Raspberry Pi platform is not just the inexpensive aspect of the hardware itself, but the flexibility available in switching the software in use simply by swapping in a different microSD card.

Yes there is setup work involved as with any software, but something like pCP offers an enormous payoff in the end once the initial set and forget configuration is all done. You can then try that out all the while keeping any original software (i.e. RoPieee, Volumio, Moode, etc...) off to the side in case you want to use it again, and much of it is interoperable anyway, you can make a previously DLNA/UPnP endpoint such as Moode a Squeezelite renderer with just 3 clicks.

A distro like pCP is also super convenient in that it can be both a server and an endpoint/player simultaneously, and it doesn't struggle with doing that double duty despite the somewhat limited system resources in terms of the CPU and RAM of the Raspberry Pi.

I've never been a Roon user, however I am ready to demote my daily driver DLNA/UPnP server to backup status, and use LMS moving forward. I have already setup and used both a separate LMS running on Ubuntu, and also a combined LMS/Squeezelite renderer running on pCP as both you, and more recently @OldNick have done. A very ready for primetime solution to say the least, though at last check-in the pCP gods were frowning on @MrEd for some reason, but perhaps by now he's made amends with them and had his streaming rights reinstated. Or maybe the pCP gods weren't involved and his system just auto-updated at an inopportune moment as has happened to others in the past with RoPieee for example. I always shut down auto updates for that very reason.

Funny you mention me today...
A renewed attempt is on my docket for tomorrow... may the force be with me 🙂

 

[marantzfan]

I switched to Qobuz late last year and then this summer quit Roon and switched to LMS with PiCorePlayer for my endpoints. All working well and was surprised the amount of info available via the Material Skin with PcP - lyrics, biographies, album liner notes, etc. Not Roon but close. I have plenty o'DSD files that play flawlessly too. And saving a couple hundred bucks a year as well. If you need more info let me know.

After that last post of mine, I started reading up on LMS and PiCorePlayer. Those are certainly options. I have a dedicated audio PC thst I use as my Roon core and 2 Rpi 4b’s that I use as endpoints. All of which would be repurposed to whichever new software solution I go with.

You mention DSD…are you sending those wired or wirelessly to your endpoint?

 

[airdronian]

I'd been considering trying to set up LMS as a potential replacement for Roon, even as just a test. I wondered about my Onkyo smart speaker, which is a Chromecast device and is used in various places around here. Turns out there is an LMS to Cast Bridge available and is in the LMS 3rd Party repositories. That potential issue may not turn out to be an issue at all.

 

[Rudy]

I alternately love/hate Roon. But the parts I like are what keep me using it. Streaming from Qobuz will never be my primary music source. My own collection of digital files (ripped discs, downloaded purchases, needle drops, etc.) are what I listen to the most. Roon organizes them better than any other software I've tried, and I've tried every popular one out there, and never liked how they made a trainwreck of my music library. I also visually see the clear path that the digital files take from my server to whichever streaming device I'm using.

The fact that it works with all of the devices in my house, and is so painless to set up and use with them, is well worth the miniscule cost per month. The way Roon decentralizes digital playback is something no other system offers--there's a server process (Roon Server, formerly Roon Core) which can run on any reasonably powerful networked computer, a transport (renderer) which is built into many new streaming devices these days or run from a cheap DIY streamer, and control point (remote) which can be a tablet, phone, or desktop computer application. Some of the other software solutions require a computer tethered to an audio system and nope, I'm not going that clumsy route.

If something better comes along, I'd be all for it. But unfortunately Roon is the only thing I've tried that I can live with.

Qobuz is just icing on the cake--it expands on my own library and integrates well with Roon, so everything is under one player and I don't need multiple apps to play music. Basically, if I can hand someone the tablet with Roon pinned as the active app, they can figure out how to use it easily.

Roon and Qobuz are cheap. What, the cost of two CDs per month, combined...or a 180g LP? In the past, I was buying several CDs per month and probably never played half of them very much. Qobuz alone saves me a lot more than what I paid on clunker CDs and LPs I may have bought. Roon is worth the cost per month based on how it helps me organize and maintain the collection.

If a person has few or no music files in a library, Roon is unnecessary. If all someone uses is Qobuz or another service, I see no need for Roon.

 

[MikeyFresh]

I'd been considering trying to set up LMS as a potential replacement for Roon, even as just a test. I wondered about my Onkyo smart speaker, which is a Chromecast device and is used in various places around here. Turns out there is an LMS to Cast Bridge available and is in the LMS 3rd Party repositories. That potential issue may not turn out to be an issue at all.

Non-issue from my recent experience, that LMS Cast Bridge plugin works very well, exposes any Chromecast compatible devices as available endpoints to the Logitech Media Server. My WiiM Pro Plus, Chromecast With Google (Android) TV, and older Chromecast Ultra all present themselves as available endpoints for playback.

The only playback "limitation" is the one already in place with Chromecast, that being a top resolution of 24/96, playing a 24/192 file still works but is downsampled.

 

[OldNick]

LMS/pcp has been a game changer for me. I've just completed my final fiddling with buffer sizes etc and i think my days of messing with streaming solutions is pretty much over. It all just works and sounds excellent. The only change might be Qobuz connect but I'm in no hurry for it. If connect never arrives i just won't care. 😊

 

[Olson_jr]

Still a big fan of Roon, but then I bought a lifetime for $400 in November 2015, after test-driving it for a day or so.

So I guess I am down to around $4.00/month or will be pretty soon.

TBS, Roon was the best $400 I have ever spent on audio. No muss, no fuss, no long, complicated setups, it all just worked.

I'm still sporting a Tidal Family Plan @ $30/month as they don't care about whose family the folks I share with are in.

I also have a Qobuz subscription. If Qobuz offered a bigger/under-more-roofs family plan, for a comparable price, I would probably drop out of Tidal as Qobuz's Hi-Rez is so so sweet.

 

[Punker X]

Still a big fan of Roon, but then I bought a lifetime for $400 in November 2015, after test-driving it for a day or so.

So I guess I am down to around $4.00/month or will be pretty soon.

TBS, Roon was the best $400 I have ever spent on audio. No muss, no fuss, no long, complicated setups, it all just worked.

I'm still sporting a Tidal Family Plan @ $30/month as they don't care about whose family the folks I share with are in.

I also have a Qobuz subscription. If Qobuz offered a bigger/under-more-roofs family plan, for a comparable price, I would probably drop out of Tidal as Qobuz's Hi-Rez is so so sweet.

Right there with you. Bought the lifetime Roon shortly after you did. Glad I have it, even though I don't use it to its full potential. Then there is Roon ARC. Jackpot. What a bonus.. Probably the best audio purchase I've made looking back.

 

[jmathers]

After that last post of mine, I started reading up on LMS and PiCorePlayer. Those are certainly options. I have a dedicated audio PC thst I use as my Roon core and 2 Rpi 4b’s that I use as endpoints. All of which would be repurposed to whichever new software solution I go with.

You mention DSD…are you sending those wired or wirelessly to your endpoint?

Two endpoints too and a desktop PC running LMS. One endpoint (main system) is wired and the other (garage) is wireless. I have no issues running DSD files to either although I must admit I'm not as picky about the sound out in the garage.

I run LMS on my desktop computer in the basement but am considering switching to pCP running LMS on the Rpi endpoint down there instead. It'd be nice not to have to fire up the desktop to listen to tunes.

 

[inthewoodsnolonger]

Qbuz has a fantastic library of Deutsch Grammophon recordings