Thorens Anyone?

Discussion in 'All Things Analog' started by MikeT., Oct 29, 2017.

  1. MikeT.

    MikeT. Senior Member

    I did delay the final spring work until I received the record weight, BUT had two trials previously that that didn’t go well. The Thorens spring tensioning process is an audio industry mystery. Vinyl Nivana is supposed to have a video detailing steps but I haven’t been able to find it. There is no written process I’ve found either.
     
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  2. GuyK

    GuyK Junior Member

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  3. fiddlefye

    fiddlefye Senior Member

    Sent you a PM...
     
  4. MikeT.

    MikeT. Senior Member

    Thanks @GuyK, I have seen it and read it over multiple times, which is a requirement for me to begin to "get it". That coupled with the tinkering it's all beginning to make more sense. More tinkering required.
     
  5. TubeHiFiNut

    TubeHiFiNut Administrator

    Y'all are orders of magnitude more patient than me. ;)

    Setting up the tonearm and cartridge are frustrating enough.....then you throw in SPRINGS. ;)
     
  6. fiddlefye

    fiddlefye Senior Member

    One system at a time..... figure out one, get on with the next.
     
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  7. Try1256

    Try1256 Junior Member

    You mean they don't all have springs????
    :lol:
     
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  8. MikeT.

    MikeT. Senior Member

    Springs.....boing.......I've learned even more on my fourth "go-round" on the bounce phase of my Thorens. After removing the bottom plate and balancing the table on three large plastic containers to allow adjustment of the individual spring tension, I think I'm getting it. When I was was able to push up on the sub-chassis and get a feel for the amount of tension it was going to require to raise various areas, I felt more comfortable with applying "uneven tension" from spring to spring. Getting the springs centered on the sub-chassis posts made a big difference in the ultimate result.

    Going even more slowly, a few turns at a time, the platter was adjusted to achieve a good five to seven second bounce. Sounds very good, but the motor still needs a little azimuth adjustment to keep the belt from rubbing ever so slightly against the speed change lever.

    But when you banish gremlins from one place, you know they often appear elsewhere. :frown:

    Everything sounds great until the arm gets a little more than 3/4 way through the record side, then skips back a groove and an audible distortion begins to appear. I'm not sure whether it's too much anti-skate or the tonearm is binding slightly towards the center of the record due to aging wiring. I cannot discern any binding when pushing the tonearm by hand but I imagine the force required to cause the tonearm to skip/distort would be hard to feel.

    All you Thorens guys out there.....any advice?
     
  9. Try1256

    Try1256 Junior Member

    I think you are on the right track with the springs. As far as the arm binding, sounds like the pivot bearings need adjusting, perhaps a bit too tight.

    http://www.rudi-zampa.at/Thorens-TP16-bearing clearance-adjustment.pdf
     
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  10. MikeT.

    MikeT. Senior Member

    @Try1256 , hugely, massively appreciated!!
     
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  11. MikeT.

    MikeT. Senior Member

    @Try1256 and all you other Thorens experts. I bought a NOS motor for my TD165 and have it wired up but haven’t plugged her in yet. Thought I would ask if you guys think this looks right! I downloaded another pic (second image) from another brave soul for comparison and the service page (third image) I think might be relevant.
    Before I plug this puppy in, does the first image look like I have it right.

    Thanks, in advance, really!!!!
    6BDD1B72-BDFD-4055-98FD-E4D1C981F141.jpeg 58B68D55-C026-4F3E-8BCC-8D513D4B3E56.jpeg 47286B29-43AF-44AF-8570-0DD3B753521F.jpeg
     
  12. Try1256

    Try1256 Junior Member

    If you are replacing the phase capacitor, dont trust the schematic. It was wrong for my 160. Some were made with a .33 uf others with a .15uf. Mine was a .15. The picture below was how mine was wired. The AC was connected to the other side IMG_4349.jpg


    IMG_4348.jpg
     
  13. MikeT.

    MikeT. Senior Member

    I am soooooo happy:dance The NOS motor is installed, turned on, has not blown up and is running absolutely silently!!!

    When I first applied the power I heard a slight noise and the platter stopped turning and my heart sank. I imagined the worst but removed the platter and the belt had simply slipped off the new pulley. A quick adjustment with the azimuth screw, the belt slipped up the pulley, I replaced the platter and away it went, running smoothly with NO motor noise at all as with the old motor.

    Hopefully a few adjustments to the tonearm and I might have a keeper. If nothing else, I may put a new tonearm on it.

    Thanks for all the comments and helpful advice. I’ll say that every Thorens model I research with the same motor, had a different implementation of the motor connection and capacitors. In the end I reconnected with previous connections and trusted another view of the TD165 motor wiring from another soul.

    Thanks again. More on the tonearm as I go.
     
  14. TubeHiFiNut

    TubeHiFiNut Administrator

    Good job, Mike! :)
     
  15. MikeT.

    MikeT. Senior Member

    A slight development, a low level hum, noticeable when close to the speakers. The NOS motor is working well, smooth, seems on speed. Is it possible that the older capacitor in circuit is causing the hum since I installed the new motor?
     
  16. Try1256

    Try1256 Junior Member

    Probably not. Are you using the stock Thorens phono cable? If so, I would ditch it and rewire the out to use an rca phono cable and a standard ground wire.
     
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  17. MikeT.

    MikeT. Senior Member

    @Try1256 , thanks! I also mounted the DL103 on a new (old) TP60 headshell I acquired with a tonearm I purchased for parts on eBay. That's a new twist as well. I'll mount up a Ortofon OM10 on the original headshell and give it a go to see if the hum disappears.
    I am also considering a Rega or Moth RB-202. I can't really tell the difference between the two other than the bearing claim that Moth makes for their upgrade. With the new SILENT motor (NOS), this table may deserve a new tonearm.
     
  18. Try1256

    Try1256 Junior Member

    SME
     
    fiddlefye likes this.
  19. MikeT.

    MikeT. Senior Member

    @Try1256 I KNEW you were going to say that ;)
     
  20. fiddlefye

    fiddlefye Senior Member

    What is your spindle to pivot range with that table? If you change arms you might need to make a new board anyway, right? Of course if you change the arm then the whole suspension needs to be reset once more....
     

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