Interesting Horn thread Someplace Else (AA)
- Thread starter mhardy6647
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EML, either 20AM, 20B, or 30A. I'm thinking something that is robust and does not need much fettling, so maybe transformer coupled (PP or SE). If I decide SE, monkey style direct-couple would be an option. Too may options and for an amp that will be quite different to what I'm used to: a bit nervous spending $$$ on the great unknown.
Yep, 6C6 or 310A seems to come down to system and personal preference. I could live easily with either.
Regarding horn honkiness: I wonder if the liklihood of honkiness, and it's offensiveness, increase as frequency decreases: is the risk is greater for horns operating at 800Hz that at 1,600Hz? Is it harder to seamlessly cross horn-loaded drivers (or a horn-loaded compression driver with a big direct-radiator) lower in frequency?
I certainly think that most horns sound (much) better when not used within an octave or so of their cutoff. Not sure if I'd qualify the audible issues that result from noncompliance with that advice as honkiness, though.
Of course, I am currently violating that "octave above cutoff" dictum, but I like to be contrary.
Of course, I am currently violating that "octave above cutoff" dictum, but I like to be contrary.
Some good thoughts in this thread. What I have found to be of utmost importance with getting horns "right" is the amplifier/speaker synergy. Conventional wisdom is that a tube amp wins the day, and for the most part, that is correct. However, some tube amps are just not a good match for horns. I found that my LM 845 based tube integrated did not match well with my klipschorns. Now this is a very good sounding amp, but it just didn't bring out the best in the big horns. But it sounded great with Forte IIIs.
So replacing the LM with a Decware Torii II made a world of difference. Same transparency and dynamics of the LM, but with a much smoother presentation that suits the khorns. I don't get ANY honky, shouty or otherwise unlistenable sound out of these speakers now. Anything I can throw at them never trips them up. Match made in heaven? Maybe. But certainly a match for my room and my ears.
Other things are of course, givens. Room treatment is very important. And of course, attention must be given to source components and material. Horns will bear out any crap you put in front of them. So purveyors of cheap receivers and seedee players get what they get.
So my final thought is one I'm sure many of you have heard before. But most of the time when someone disparages horn speakers it's because all (or some) of the variables were just plain wrong. But get it right, and good horns can hold their own with any design and need have no apologies made for them.
Shakey
So replacing the LM with a Decware Torii II made a world of difference. Same transparency and dynamics of the LM, but with a much smoother presentation that suits the khorns. I don't get ANY honky, shouty or otherwise unlistenable sound out of these speakers now. Anything I can throw at them never trips them up. Match made in heaven? Maybe. But certainly a match for my room and my ears.
Other things are of course, givens. Room treatment is very important. And of course, attention must be given to source components and material. Horns will bear out any crap you put in front of them. So purveyors of cheap receivers and seedee players get what they get.
So my final thought is one I'm sure many of you have heard before. But most of the time when someone disparages horn speakers it's because all (or some) of the variables were just plain wrong. But get it right, and good horns can hold their own with any design and need have no apologies made for them.
Shakey
Speaking of Dr./Prof. Jean-Michel Le Cléac’h, I just now stumbled across this, and thought it cool enough to share.
My apologies if everyone knew of this but me
http://www.rintelen.ch/download/JMMLC_horns_lecture_etf10.pdf
My apologies if everyone knew of this but me
http://www.rintelen.ch/download/JMMLC_horns_lecture_etf10.pdf
It was new to me. Thanks for posting the link.Speaking of Dr./Prof. Jean-Michel Le Cléac’h, I just now stumbled across this, and thought it cool enough to share.
My apologies if everyone knew of this but me
http://www.rintelen.ch/download/JMMLC_horns_lecture_etf10.pdf
Speaking of Dr./Prof. Jean-Michel Le Cléac’h, I just now stumbled across this, and thought it cool enough to share.
My apologies if everyone knew of this but me
http://www.rintelen.ch/download/JMMLC_horns_lecture_etf10.pdf
Good stuff.
Thank you, Mark.
Most DHTs are pretty flexible, but I reckon that might be pushing it. Drawing roughly 10mA, would put the grid at -2V relative to cathode: not the most linear part of the curves and (not having calced it) the gain might suffer. It could "work", but it would not be ideal... probably no better than what you already have.
I certainly think that most horns sound (much) better when not used within an octave or so of their cutoff. Not sure if I'd qualify the audible issues that result from noncompliance with that advice as honkiness, though.
Of course, I am currently violating that "octave above cutoff" dictum, but I like to be contrary.
I have found this to be true as well. I always _aim_ to stick to the octave above cutoff rule, and generally, the closer I am the better it sounds (empirically).
Cheers,
Gable
Currently running the EMILARs (with JBL 2441 drivers) first order at ca. 600 Hz nominal XO -- apostasy
Currently running the EMILARs (with JBL 2441 drivers) first order at ca. 600 Hz nominal XO -- apostasy
Emilars and 2441s. 'Nuff said.
There's interesting chatter going on elsewhere about modern high-end horns -- I am just increasingly bewildered by the complexity of the whole subject. Maybe I'll get me some vintage 4" radio shack cone MRs and some 2" cone tweeters with chrome dustcaps & be done with it 
There's interesting chatter going on elsewhere about modern high-end horns -- I am just increasingly bewildered by the complexity of the whole subject. Maybe I'll get me some vintage 4" radio shack cone MRs and some 2" cone tweeters with chrome dustcaps & be done with it
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.
Well, I'm brainstormin' here... you know, there are no wrong answers when one's brainstormin'.
Thanks for the reply
“would not be ideal “ is a accurate description of my system, but I like it.
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