Altec 608 vs 612

[ihmeyers]

Over the years I've read a lot about the Abbey Road Studios 612 cabs with the 605A. Enough that after watching a documentary about the studio I decided I wanted to put together a pair. I don't know a great deal about the Altec history but had read up on the 612 cabinet and its match with a 605A or 604.

This weekend I found a pair of 608 cabs (that I see much less about online) with 605A drivers for sale. This cabinet was obviously styled more for home use than the plain silver or black 612s, but I was surprised to see that it's got more cu volume than a 612 as well. Would this not make the 608/605 combination a better performer than the 612? I just don't see much about the 608 online.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Katalyst]

Did you purchase them? If so please post pictures.

 

[ihmeyers]

No. Haven't done anything yet. Debating whether or not I get

a) replica of Abbey Road speakers (silver 612 cab with 605A)
b) some variation of above (silver 612 cab with 604 driver)
c) 608 cabs with 605A drivers. Pretty rare I think but $$$$

I have a number of pair of speakers so these wouldn't be the mains and would need to sound good on 50s-60s Jazz, vocal, rock.

 

[mhardy6647]

Not to get all preachy or nothin', but: There is nothing wrong with 605A Duplexes! They get a bad rap for no other reason (as best I can tell) than that they're less sensitive than the 604, so they weren't quite plug and play (or, more to the point, drop in replacements) for studios. A catalyst in scuttling the whole company, too (at least, according to the same internet lore I suspect we've all read). Whoops.

As a typically egocentric but otherwise pointless aside: I do kick myself on a regular basis for not picking up a single, perfect 605A for $75 some years back when the opportunity presented itself. What was I thinking!?

As to what you should do, @ihmeyers -- any of the above seem fine like fine options to me. It would be cool to have Abbey Roadesque cabinets, methinks, loaded with pretty much any flavor of Duplex (if that helps any). Crossover's important: I am (still) of the opinion that one can do better than the purpose-built Altec XOs for the fine Duplex family of products.

I have a number of pair of speakers so these wouldn't be the mains and would need to sound good on 50s-60s Jazz, vocal, rock.

[emphasis added]

Oh, I think that's pretty much a given.



PS The Beatles' oeuvre sounds mighty good on Duplexes -- that I can vouch for. So do, e.g., Ray Charles, Joan Osborne, the Black Crowes, and Ol' Blue Eyes. Indeed, I don't think I've heard much that didn't -- OK... maybe the Moody Blues' Go Now. But that recording, I think, will sound horrible on pretty much anything.

 

[ihmeyers]

All of this stuff has gotten so expensive. Vintage 612 silver cabs $3200 on e-bay. I can replicas built for about $2k but shipping quote was $1000 (to S. Florida) 605A drivers $2,500-$3k. All of this with the stock so/so Altec networks. Getting Jeff Markwart networks built will only add to the costs.

I wish I would have discovered the vintage stuff years ago when it wasn't as pricey.

 

[mhardy6647]

Yeah, well -- I mean, there's price, and there's value.

It doesn't help that the cost of good lumber (or, heck, even crummy lumber) escalated a while back (I cannot even guess why that might've happened ), and -- although it's come down some -- it's still fairly stratospheric.

 

[mhardy6647]

You could always go the RCA LC-1A/Refrigerator cabinet route, instead -- but I don't think that'll save you any money.

 

[ihmeyers]

Plus the 612 in silver cabs have a very low wife acceptance factor. I think they're cool because those are the Abbey Road monitors wife ans I saw in a documentary last week. She didn't find them quite as cool. I think she used the word horrible.

 

[ihmeyers]

You could always go the RCA LC-1A/Refrigerator cabinet route, instead -- but I don't think that'll save you any money.

I was considering those as well. I have someone that can build the cabs for me but those are even bigger and I am way out of room. I told my wife we're going to need 7,000 sq ft of living space for all the gear I want. If that's the case I'm going to need to be saving for quite a while longer. 😂

 

[mhardy6647]

It could be argued that if one can afford a pair of Duplexes and appropriate boxes for 'em -- one should also be able to afford a dedicated space for 'em.

Of course, I've tried similar argument to convince Mrs. H that we need a tractor... but it hasn't worked so far.

In all seriousness, when it comes to putting up with my hifi hobby -- my wife is a saint.
(actually, when it comes up to putting up with me in general, the same comment stands... and she's not even looking over my shoulder as I type this...)

 

[mhardy6647]

The LC-1A is fabulous.
I know a fellow who has a pair in very nice bespoke cabinets... but I think he has a pair in refrigerators, too.

 

[ihmeyers]

It could be argued that if one can afford a pair of Duplexes and appropriate boxes for 'em -- one should also be able to afford a dedicated space for 'em.

Of course, I've tried similar argument to convince Mrs. H that we need a tractor... but it hasn't worked so far.

In all seriousness, when it comes to putting up with my hifi hobby -- my wife is a saint.
(actually, when it comes up to putting up with me in general, the same comment stands... and she's not even looking over my shoulder as I type this...)

My wife is as well and we really are looking for a new house. Free government money & absurdly low interest rates have nearly doubled prices in some parts of the country so it doesn't make my task any easier. I think what I would have to do is rotate them in and out of systems. I'd sell some speakers but they're so expensive to ship it swamps the cost of the speakers. I have a pair of Revel F-50s that are in pretty good shape physically (fine electronically) for $600 (I paid $2500 used 4 years ago) but I don't have boxes and they'd cost $500 just to ship. The last pair of speakers I sold (a pair of Tonians) the guy that bought them wanted them SO much, he hired someone to drive from his area in Texas to my house in FL to pick them up and drive them back to Texas for him. Clearly, in his case cost was no object.

 

[ihmeyers]

I've decided on the 612 cabs with 605A drivers though I need another driver. As far as the cab goes, I need to get it off the floor because IMO it's way too low to the ground to image well. How high does it need to be raised? Do I need it to be on a stand (I almost have to go custom to get one that would work) or could I attach very solid furniture legs to the bottom of the cabinet. I have not seen or heard of anyone doing that, but that seems to me like it might even work better than a stand from a resonance standpoint.

Thanks.

 

[Audionut]

I've decided on the 612 cabs with 605A drivers though I need another driver. As far as the cab goes, I need to get it off the floor because IMO it's way too low to the ground to image well. How high does it need to be raised? Do I need it to be on a stand (I almost have to go custom to get one that would work) or could I attach very solid furniture legs to the bottom of the cabinet. I have not seen or heard of anyone doing that, but that seems to me like it might even work better than a stand from a resonance standpoint.

Thanks.

What’s the height of your ear at listening level? Also, what is the current center height of the driver when in the cabinet? How much ever lower the driver is to your ear, is what you will use to determine your leg or base height with.
I have the tapered spindle legs on my 604E build. Both for bottom venting and looks. I would have built them with a solid wood baseboard trimmed base had I went with a traditional look (then I’d have added fluted columns as well).

 

[ihmeyers]

I don't have the cabs yet, they are being built for me. The cabinet height is 30". I'm going to guesstimate that the tweeter is about 18" off the ground then. My ear is about 45" off the ground. I have seen small satellite type speakers with 27" stand but never anything this big. Certainly I couldn't use 27" furniture legs. I suppose I COULD get a stand built that high.

Audionut, do you have photos of your 604E build? I'm guessing it's in a taller cabinet. I know in Abbey Road Studios the 612s sat on highis stands in the control room. If the cabs in the photo are indeed 30" high it would make the stands about 17" off the ground if my math is right...

 

[Audionut]

Here is my build below, you will definitely want stands if you don’t go for a larger cabinet.

DIY - Altec 604E’s - A soon to be proud duplex owner.

Ahhh, congrats! I'm in a similar situation too. I'm actually waiting to hear how the home inspection goes in a few hours. Who needs a dining room!!?? ;-) So how’d the inspection go? On my end our foundation should be poured this week.

hifihaven.org

 

[Leben]

I've decided on the 612 cabs with 605A drivers though I need another driver. As far as the cab goes, I need to get it off the floor because IMO it's way too low to the ground to image well. How high does it need to be raised? Do I need it to be on a stand (I almost have to go custom to get one that would work) or could I attach very solid furniture legs to the bottom of the cabinet. I have not seen or heard of anyone doing that, but that seems to me like it might even work better than a stand from a resonance standpoint.

Thanks.

FWIW, I think you’ll be quite pleased with the 605/612 combination. 612s are one of my favorite cabinets. If my memory is correct, the 605 uses the 416 woofer which I’ve found to have substantially better bass in 612 cabinets than the 604 duplex that uses the 515 woofer.

I use a couple different 612 cabinets in my home systems. I‘ve found that I prefer them raised a bit to get the horn closer to ear height, or close when seated. The newer pair is a more modern version of the 612, They have simple, welded steel, homemade stands to get them up a bit. When there were 604s in these cabinets (with stands) I found them satisfactory even though the tweeter horns were slightly below ear height. The top of the cabinets measure 38” from the ground.

In my older pair, I use Stephens Coaxials and prefer the horns a little higher. I’m a function over form guy to a fault so I’ve continued to use a pair of old plant stands that happen to be the correct height. They measure 46-47” to the top of the cabinets.

I’d like to adjust my function over form habit a bit and come up with better stands for my old pair, I’m anxious to see what you come up with. Best of luck with your project, sounds like a fun one,

 

[ihmeyers]

Quick question on the drivers. Which is the positive terminal on the woofer and the compression driver? I'm going to be using a Markwart xover so I need to know. I believe I have read that someone that used the battery test determined that

on the Woofer 1 is positive and 2 is negative
on the Compression driver 1 is negative and 2 is positive

Can anyone confirm this?

Thanks much.