If they do real high res I’ll ditch Qobuz. I’m tired of waiting for a connect feature and would like my algorithm/suggestions/playlists/habits and likes in one place. Most of my streaming is in car/gym anyway. I do use Qobuz when I travel, downloading selected albums before a flight.
 
If they do offer it, I'm going to penalize them a year and hold out before signing up, since they have been jerking the world along with empty promises for at least double that long.
 
If they do offer it, I'm going to penalize them a year and hold out before signing up, since they have been jerking the world along with empty promises for at least double that long.
I guess I look at it differently. I'm ok with the fact that they held off until they got things sorted out. Nothing worse then launching prematurely.
 
If they do offer it, I'm going to penalize them a year and hold out before signing up, since they have been jerking the world along with empty promises for at least double that long.
I’m at a big industry event in France and Spotify is here. They just told me they’re going to uninvited all the stars and DJs that were about to play upon me telling them this news (I kid I kid. But they don’t oook like they’re hurting for money).
 
If they do offer it, I'm going to penalize them a year and hold out before signing up, since they have been jerking the world along with empty promises for at least double that long.
Actually it's well over 6 years now they've been jerking around on this, since CES 2017, when they first announced lossless "Hi-Fi" as coming soon, with beta testing occurring that following March. Radio silence then ensued for the next 4 years.

I guess I look at it differently. I'm ok with the fact that they held off until they got things sorted out. Nothing worse then launching prematurely.
Spotify's most recent lossless promise/renege is now over 2 years old, that splashy announcement by Billie Eilish/Finneas made in Feb. 2021. This wasn't a case of making sure everything was working right and that they not offer something prematurely, that was Amazon/Apple having torpedoed Spotify's planned revenue projections by racing to the bottom on price with their own lossless offerings, both of which were rolled out very quickly thereafter.
 
Actually it's well over 6 years now they've been jerking around on this, since CES 2017, when they first announced lossless "Hi-Fi" as coming soon, with beta testing occurring that following March. Radio silence then ensued for the next 4 years.


Spotify's most recent lossless promise/renege is now over 2 years old, that splashy announcement by Billie Eilish/Finneas made in Feb. 2021. This wasn't a case of making sure everything was working right and that they not offer something prematurely, that was Amazon/Apple having torpedoed Spotify's planned revenue projections by racing to the bottom on price with their own lossless offerings, both of which were rolled out very quickly thereafter.
But that is the nature of a successful business. Adapt according to where the market is. It would have made no sense at all to roll out a product that will likely fail if the market had changed.
 
But that is the nature of a successful business.
I don't know of too many successful businesses that announce a forthcoming offering to their customers not once but twice, only to then renege on that offering for a period of not months but years. Typically a forthcoming offering is only announced when it is imminent, otherwise it is kept fully under wraps, and in this case that would have been very important given the nimble ability of Spotify's big boy competitors to foul up their plan.

Adapt according to where the market is.
Exactly, so when you've announced something and can't deliver on it, the original plan needs a revamp. Adding audiobooks would have been one such revamp, but it shouldn't take well over 2 years to arrive at that course of action. Spotify knew who their deep pocketed competitors were all along, so various contingencies should have been mapped out prior to that 2021 grand announcement. They looked bad in hiring Billie Eilish and Finneas to announce something they couldn't deliver on, and then take 2+ years to hatch a Plan B.
 
I don't know of too many successful businesses that announce a forthcoming offering to their customers not once but twice, only to then renege on that offering for a period of not months but years. Typically a forthcoming offering is only announced when it is imminent, otherwise it is kept fully under wraps, and in this case that would have been very important given the nimble ability of Spotify's big boy competitors to foul up their plan.


Exactly, so when you've announced something and can't deliver on it, the original plan needs a revamp. Adding audiobooks would have been one such revamp, but it shouldn't take well over 2 years to arrive at that course of action. Spotify knew who their deep pocketed competitors were all along, so various contingencies should have been mapped out prior to that 2021 grand announcement. They looked bad in hiring Billie Eilish and Finneas to announce something they couldn't deliver on, and then take 2+ years to hatch a Plan B.
And they are also doing just fine without it. It's a luxury, not a necessity. And yes, businesses do stupid things all the time. But this is really did very little to inconvenience their existing customers.
 
And they are also doing just fine without it. It's a luxury, not a necessity. And yes, businesses do stupid things all the time. But this is really did very little to inconvenience their existing customers.
Yeah, it’s a luxury they are doing fine without. I would just love to know how they spent 2-1/2 years to come up with what they did. Maybe they’re holding an ace up their sleeve that they haven’t revealed yet.
 
Yeah, it’s a luxury they are doing fine without. I would just love to know how they spent 2-1/2 years to come up with what they did. Maybe they’re holding an ace up their sleeve that they haven’t revealed yet.
It's likely the same program they had 2 years back. And, I'm guessing, they are offering nothing more than cd quality, for their "high res".
When it was only Tidal offering high res, Spotify had a good niche to sneak into. Good quality at a good price. But, as the competition launched likely the same thing Spotify was going to, and perhaps at a lower cost, then there was no opportunity to differentiate, and no point in launching it.
This audio book thing intrigues me. Amazon owns the market through Audible, so if Spotify can compete with that, and also offer good quality music, it might be enough to pry me away from Tidal. Or, maybe Spotify will break open its considerable wallet and buy MQA. Probably a pretty good deal right now.
 
I would be over the moon about Spotify going lossless assuming they do a good job of it. I like their app and would love stream from their app to a streamer via spotify connect. I love the metadata Roon gets from allmusic.com but I would gladly give that up to drop down to one subscription service for my music.

That Spotify library is second to none!
 
Maybe they’re holding an ace up their sleeve that they haven’t revealed yet.
I've wondered that too, likely the only thing that would jazz people including their current Premium subscribers is if they somehow make it the same or very similar pricing to what they are already paying. If not, then Amazon and Apple will have succeeded in fouling things up for Spotify, at least to the tune of about 70 million paid subs each. Spotify still way ahead at 180 million paid subs, but as you said in an earlier post, you'd have to wonder how many more paid subs Spotify might have had Amazon/Apple not thrown that wrench in the works 2 years ago.
 
And they are also doing just fine without it.
Not on a P&L level they aren't. While they have far and away the most paid subs, they are still losing huge money every quarter, and that's only tolerable for so long.

I'd think Spotify having long ago exited the "start-up" stage would have found a way to be at least close to profitable by now, but they aren't, their Q1 2023 earnings call saw another gigantic loss of $156 million, that following a $231 million loss for Q4 2022.

They did print a bunch of money with their IPO of course, but if the street ever turns on them that cash cow could be milked dry at some point, as it shouldn't be so damn hard to make money on a $3 billion business.

Amazon and Apple very well may also lose a lot on their music businesses, they don't report that information, but they can also tolerate that for pretty much any foreseeable future, where Spotify cannot.

While Rhapsody was the first modern streaming service, Spotify dates back to 2006 and had a huge head start on Amazon/Apple in the market. In that sense their paid subs numbers aren't all that impressive, with Amazon and Apple more than nipping at their heels despite joining the party relatively late in the game. Many of Spotify's management choices look suspect, excepting the decision to float a "direct listing" IPO that exchanged 30 million shares on day one.

I wonder if one day Spotify will be forced to kill their "free" (ad supported) tier, as even though the paid tier is huge, it has never been able to cover all of their other losses, and losing hundreds of millions of dollars a quarter can't go on forever. If Spotify's UI/UX, library, recommendation algorithm, etc is really all that and a bag of chips, it ought to be able to stand on its own. That free tier no doubt cannibalizes the paid tier to some extent, so unless they can just keep raising the price on the advertisers to better offset their operating loss, I imagine they might one day have to kill that freebie service.

I'd also be curious about the % of their losses attributable to music, vs. podcasts, vs. audiobooks.
 
I've wondered that too, likely the only thing that would jazz people including their current Premium subscribers is if they somehow make it the same or very similar pricing to what they are already paying. If not, the Amazon and Apple will have succeeded in fouling things up for Spotify, at least to the tune of about 70 million paid subs each. Spotify still way ahead at 180 million paid subs, but as you said in an earlier post, you'd have to wonder how many more paid subs Spotify might have had Amazon/Apple not thrown that wrench in the works 2 years ago.
I highly doubt that Apple and Amazon getting those subscriptions is because they offered higher resolution. For the -vast- majority of people, Spotify meets their sound quality threshold. They got those subscriptions because Apple is Apple and people like Apple, and Amazon because Amazon Prime is also ubiquitous. And I say that because if they got those subscriptions because of higher-res, Spotify would have done it. They have enough $$$ to research the market's wants to the ends of the earth. That they haven't done it also says to me, once again, what I already assume- people don't really care that much about resolution beyond a certain people. Most people don't even know what it means. We all tend to think the type of people we personally talk to represent more people than they actually do.
 
For what its worth (not much) here's a theory for why they haven't done it.
If they do it, it'll be at a premium price. A price which will exceed the arbitrary price most people have in their heads for what they want to pay for a streaming service, but it's not targeted at 'most' people. Still, the larger population that doesn't really care about resolution will suddenly find themselves in a situation where they don't have 'the best' that's on offer. And for whatever reason, streaming on what's now 2nd best isn't as appealing to them as before when it wasn't 2nd best. So... they become unhappy and go to another service, even though nothing changed for what they were paying. So Spotify makes a few people happy and makes a lot more unhappy about their place in life, and what they can afford.
 
I highly doubt that Apple and Amazon getting those subscriptions is because they offered higher resolution. For the -vast- majority of people, Spotify meets their sound quality threshold. They got those subscriptions because Apple is Apple and people like Apple, and Amazon because Amazon Prime is also ubiquitous. And I say that because if they got those subscriptions because of higher-res, Spotify would have done it. They have enough $$$ to research the market's wants to the ends of the earth. That they haven't done it also says to me, once again, what I already assume- people don't really care that much about resolution beyond a certain people. Most people don't even know what it means. We all tend to think the type of people we personally talk to represent more people than they actually do.
I do tend to forget that people like myself and others that are interested in higher-resolution streaming are a very small subset of the overall audience. I was thinking that Spotify and its executives look like fools for making promises and then taking 2-1/2 years to come up with a seemingly weak offering. They may look like fools to me, but the vast majority of their subscribers are probably not even aware of the supposed fiasco, given where the announcements are made and the publications that cover the news. They can effectively ignore us while tossing out a bone now and then.
 
All the speculation in this thread reminds me of the way some 60’s TV series would sign off, enticing one to, “Tune In Next Time.” I think it was Batman, or maybe Soap, or FIDK, all of them?

  • When will Spotify Supremium finally arrive, if ever?
  • Why did they announce so prematurely?
  • How can they compete?
  • What will it cost?
  • Will the big streamers crush the little guys?
  • Just what is hidden up their sleeve?
  • These exciting questions — and many others — will be answered in the next exciting episode of Spotify Supremium.
 
All the speculation in this thread reminds me of the way some 60’s TV series would sign off, enticing one to, “Tune In Next Time.” I think it was Batman, or maybe Soap, or FIDK, all of them?

  • When will Spotify Supremium finally arrive, if ever?
  • Why did they announce so prematurely?
  • How can they compete?
  • What will it cost?
  • Will the big streamers crush the little guys?
  • Just what is hidden up their sleeve?
  • These exciting questions — and many others — will be answered in the next exciting episode of Spotify Supremium.
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I do tend to forget that people like myself and others that are interested in higher-resolution streaming are a very small subset of the overall audience. I was thinking that Spotify and its executives look like fools for making promises and then taking 2-1/2 years to come up with a seemingly weak offering. They may look like fools to me, but the vast majority of their subscribers are probably not even aware of the supposed fiasco, given where the announcements are made and the publications that cover the news. They can effectively ignore us while tossing out a bone now and then.
Spotify has 500+ million users and 180 million subscribers. What’s the overall audio forum population? I have no idea but it’s small compared to that. Even going by the very unscientific method of looking at comments on Facebook ads fed to a broad audience …audiophile tendencies seem to get mocked as much as they’re championed. Our industry hasn’t done a great job of selling itself to the masses.
 
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